Main pages:
http://homepages.rootsweb.com/~willspnc/spence/dnatables.htm
http://www.familytreedna.com/public/Spence/
I have
grouped together families tentatively, as shown by the colours.
Table
1. E3a.
|
Most Distant Ancestor |
* |
Kit |
3 |
3 |
1 |
3 |
3 |
3 |
4 |
3 |
4 |
3 |
3 |
3 |
4 |
4 |
4 |
4 |
4 |
4 |
4 |
4 |
4 |
4 |
4 |
4 |
4 |
4 |
G |
Y |
Y |
4 |
6 |
5 |
5 |
C |
C |
4 |
4 |
|
H |
9 |
9 |
9 |
9 |
8 |
8 |
2 |
8 |
3 |
8 |
9 |
8 |
5 |
5 |
5 |
5 |
5 |
4 |
3 |
4 |
4 |
6 |
6 |
6 |
6 |
6 |
A |
C |
C |
5 |
0 |
7 |
7 |
D |
D |
4 |
3 |
||
|
a |
3 |
0 |
|
1 |
5 |
5 |
6 |
8 |
9 |
9 |
2 |
9 |
8 |
9 |
9 |
5 |
4 |
7 |
7 |
8 |
9 |
4 |
4 |
4 |
4 |
0 |
T |
A |
A |
6 |
7 |
6 |
0 |
Y |
Y |
2 |
8 |
||
|
p |
|
|
|
|
a |
b |
|
|
|
| |
|
| |
|
a |
b |
|
|
|
|
|
|
a |
b |
c |
d |
|
A |
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
||
|
l |
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
1 |
|
2 |
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
I |
I |
|
|
|
|
a |
b |
|
|
||
|
o |
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
H |
I |
I |
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
||
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
4 |
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
||
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
a |
b |
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
||
|
Plymouth,
Washington Co NC |
E3a |
18995 |
13 |
21 |
15 |
10 |
15 |
18 |
11 |
12 |
12 |
13 |
11 |
30 |
16 |
8 |
10 |
11 |
11 |
25 |
14 |
21 |
32 |
13 |
15 |
16 |
17 |
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
Notes
for Table 1:
E3a is an
African Y haplotype. The haplotypes above were predicted from the STR markers
above, rather than being properly checked by looking for SNP mutations. But in
any case it seems that this haplotype looks African, and it is not closely
related to any other Spences who have joined the project so far in these early
days. E3a is found in Europe in very small amounts, and so there is a small
possibility that this Y type came from Europe, and not directly from Africa to
America. However, Africa is far more likely. Note that Y chromosomes do not
define race.
Notes
for Table 2:
Rootsi
wrote the
classic paper on I haplotypes, and Dennis
Garvey wrote a useful summary. Ken Nordvedt now also has a new webpage summarizing the latest
findings about the regional variations found in I haplotypes. Note that I have
not yet converted this webpage over to the new naming terminology that Ken
recently proposed, which would for example make I1c become I1b2a.
I1a.
In British
contexts, I haplotypes are normally attributed to the post Roman movements of
people from especially the more northerly parts of Europe. At an early stage in
the Spence project, when there were fewer members, Ken
Nordtvedt wrote about this selection:
You have an interesting
variety of I1a
types. Two of them seem related and of the Norse variety of I1a [390=23].
One of the other is the Anglo-Saxon type [390=22], and the last is my own 15/22
at DYS19/390 type. These latter two seem not related within the last millenium
or longer.
I have had a problem coming up with a nickname
for the 15/22 I1a motif. There is a fair amount
of it all over Germany and Denmark, but it really comes into its own in Eastern
Norway and on into Sweden somewhat.
Since
making those comments, our project has new members, and Ken has further divided
up the “clusters” within I. One which is particularly unusual is that of the
family of William Spence from Ireland.
Looking
first to the so-called Anglo-Saxon I1a types, our Isaac Spence on the one hand,
and Jonathan and James Thomas Spence on the other, are felt to descend from a
first immigrant to Britain who was an “Anglo-Saxon”, broadly defined. This
means they were likely to have come from the North Sea coast of mainland Europe
between Southern Denmark and Northernmost France, and at the time they were
probably speaking one of the dialects that were to become English.
Looking to
the so-called “Norse” type, the first immigrant ancestor to Britain of Henry de
Spens and his Scots-Irish relative, Andrew Spence, may have been either a
Viking, or a Dane. It should be kept in mind that the difference between the
two was often purely political. Other likely sources of Norse genes were there
relatives the Normans and Anglo-Saxons.
It should
be pointed out that the above two generalizations are based on what is
probable. The “Anglo-Saxons”, Norse, Danes and Normans were mixed peoples who
we remember as categories in retrospect. The North Sea and English Channel in
the Dark Ages was however a chaotic time – not called “dark” for nothing. Even
the people who lived in that time might have sometimes found it hard to
categorize themselves under one of these labels! The general impression is
though that the above Spences tend to descend “more than average” from people
who came to Europe after the collapse of the European empire.
I propose
that Isaac Spence of NC may have been a relative of the KY Spences despite the
big differences on DYS385. Interestingly, the descendents of Isaac Spence seem
to have a common ancestor who received only one version of the two DYS385
markers. It is now known to be possible that a family can go from 12,16 to
12,12 in one generation, because of a special type of over-writing mutation.
Scientists are learning more now about the special ways in which the Y
chromosome maintains itself using sections of itself which reflect one another.
(Other nuclear DNA comes in exact pairs – Y DNA seems to have copies of genes
within itself.) This theory could be checked by getting more markers tested for
individuals of both families.
I1b.
(Will become I1b1 according to the latest proposals of Ken Nordtvedt.)
Ken
Nordtvedt has distinguished two
main groups of I1b. In order to distinguish I1b types, important markers
are DYS 437, 459, 448, and 449. Unfortunately our one seeming I1b participant
has not had this marker tested, but it might be interesting. On the other hand
his haplotype so far gives clear indications of being a type more common in
Eastern Europe than in Western Europe.
However kit
50383 has 25 markers in and they show him to belong to I1b, but not either of
the most common branches of I1b. Instead, this participant seems to be a member
of a branch of I1b which is now most common in Sardinia, which is uncommon
everywhere else. It is believed to have split from the rest of I1b in very
ancient times, and possibly originated in Spain or France. The Wormiston family
was aristocratic and perhaps it makes sense that they would have an unusual
international haplotype.
I1c.
(Will become I1b2a according to the latest proposals of Ken Nordtvedt.)
I1c is one
I haplotype where there is speculation that there might have been a British
presence before the post-Roman invasions. Based upon his large scale study of
statistics, there are several main groups distinguished by Ken, but it is often
difficult to be sure which one we are looking at in any particular case,
especially if there are less than 37 markers.
I? Probably the so called “x cluster” which is a cluster within I1b2 according to the new terminology proposed by Ken Nordtvedt, meaning it is a cousin to the old I1c.
N9363 has
only had 12 markers tested but I am reasonably confident that if he tests
DYS455 and DYS454 he will show the distinctive signs of the so-called x
cluster, which is found in small amounts scattered all over Europe. I have done
a special webpage about this: http://users.skynet.be/lancaster/Ix.htm
. He appears to sit within a British or Irish division of this haplogroup which
I believe to be very old.
Notes
for Table 3.
First note
that as per the normal conventions, 389-1 and 389-2 must be looked at together.
Values of 13 and 29 would imply a match on 389-2 for someone with values of 14
and 30!
All of the above
are not so far from the most common haplotype in Europe, the so-called Western Atlantic Modal, which
I have therefore marked in for reference. When slow moving markers are above
the modal value, I have used Red
background. When they are below, I have used Yellow. Fast moving markers are shown in Red letters.
R1b is also
a haplotype which has been in Western Europe for a long time. It was there
before the Celtic language was there, and possibly even before Basque. However,
R1b is now commonly associated with Celts and Basques for the reason that Celts
and Basques live in parts of Europe which were more isolated, and they maintain
a higher percentage of this haplotype than other parts of Europe.
Given how
common this haplotype is with British families, we must be careful not to
assume connections between the groups above too quickly, especially whenever
any slow moving marker is different. Note in particular how the DNA signature
of John Spence is an exact match for the WAMH, at least on slow moving markers,
and he will have millions of matches in the general European or North American
population. However, it is certainly very possible to think that the single
mutation which so far distinguishes the descendents from Lewis Spence and the
other relatives of Burwell Spence is just chance. Presumably then, the more
markers tested the more this difference will show itself up to be the
exceptional case.
I would
encourage anyone with this type of DNA signature to upgrade to 37 markers, in
order to avoid making conclusions based upon possible coincidences.
The Spence
from Carroll VA (Judge Hackler Spence, b. 1886) is not from this project, but
from a publicly searchable database called the Sorenson database (smgf.org).
Presumably the person who put this information on to that database was a
descendant or at least relative of Burwell Spence.
Note how we
have also found a match to a Spence from the Shetland Island DNA project (http://www.davidkfaux.org/shetlandislandsY-DNA3). Although
only 12 markers have been tested, the haplotype is unusual enough to suppose
that this is not a coincidence, given that the two individuals have the same
surname. So one Texas Spence family had distant relatives from the Shetland
Islands. It is likely that the Shetland Island Spences had connections to the
Orkney Island Spences, but we do not yet have any confirmed Orkney Spences.
Note to participants. The DNA
also seems to have called some participants’ paper trails into question.